Chris Benoit

I'm sure I missed the whole conversation you guys had on the Benoit murders, but I got to tell you, that really shook me up. As sad as it may be to you guys, Benoit was on my Mt Rushmore of sports idols. The guy seemed to have everything together (for a professional wrestler). I really don't think the mainstream media understood the significance of it being him that did this. That would be like Peyton Manning in football, Jeter in baseball. This guy was the model for future wrestlers, then it turns out he's a monster outside of the ring.

supermanox wrote:

I really don't think the mainstream media understood the significance of it being him that did this. That would be like Peyton Manning in football, Jeter in baseball. This guy was the model for future wrestlers, then it turns out he's a monster outside of the ring.

You know, I thought that and mentioned it, but never quite put it in those words. Couldn't really make a better comparison. It still blows all of our minds and I believe that this was not an evil man who just hated his wife and son, but something far more disturbed mentally in him that probably stemmed from some type of depression. It's just a very tragic and sad event that took place. I don't know if I feel comfortable ever calling this person a monster. Just me.

Welcome back Coop!

The Benoit situation did make for a huge discussion on the message board the day after, especially after the real story came out. In most cases a popular thread for us usually generates between 20-25 responses most times before we move onto something else. The Benoit thread did over fifty and it was all pretty much in one day.

But being a former die-hard, Benoit was one of my favorites. I loved watching his matches because they never disappointed, was very aware of his reputation as a locker room leader for the younger guys. I had a lot of respect for him and it's tragic that after all the years he spent building his reputations and establishing his legacy.....his whole life is defined by the last two days of it. It was depressing to say the least.

The weird thing is Ox, that we had posted a thread called WWE Best/Worst moments just days beofre the Benoit thing so we never actually had a thread labeled "Benoit." If interested you can read our reactions as the information was slowly coming out here.

http://sportstalku.proboards80.com/index.cgi?board=offthesubject&action=display&thread=1182264145

Funny we should talk about this today.

Autopsy results.

There were steroids and other drugs in his system, along with a highly elevated amount of testosterone, but it doesn't look like 'roid rage.

Still, the cocktail they're describing is...thought provoking, to say the least.

The only thing that bothered me about the toxicology results being released yesterday is that on the ticker for ESPN on SportsCenter all it said was that steroids were found in Benoit's system in the report.

So now every idiot who dismissed it as Roid Rage from the beginning is now going to pat themselves on the back for being right without knowing all of the facts. ESPN did not include enough information to tell anything other than that steroids were in Benoits system.

I don't know if that makes it better or worse actually. Cause at least with Roid Rage some of the accountability can be taken from Benoit. But now it all falls on him and best case scenario he had an argument with his wife that just went out of control.....there is no redeeming what he did to that boy. That was unforgivable.

I'm still suspecting some sort of mental illness, that may have been aggravated by everything he was taking. That doesn't absolve him, but despite everything that he may have done in the past, this all seems a little extreme to just be him being a monster.

I don't think we'll ever really know what was at the heart of it, and that's the saddest thing of all.

Who Dey, my thinking is more like yours on this one. With this guy's reputation I have a hard time believing this was just a fight with the wife and things got out of hand. I'm thinking everything that has happened in his life probably brought upon some type of mental illness. Again, not absolving him from what he did, but I do too think calling him a monster might be extreme. I find it interesting he drugged the child and even his wife had some type of painkiller in her system i guess. I'm really wondering if this was some type of mental illness scenario where he thought all three of them had to die to be saved or something weird like that.

Something tells me this isn't over, and there's going to be a full on investigation into WWE and a possible usage of steroids.

But if congress wants to re-open investigations of steroids in "pro wrestling" they need to also target the smaller wrestling promotions as well, such as Total Nonstop Action (TNA). I have to believe that those involved with smaller promotions feel they can get away with a lot more because there isn't a lot of attention paid to their respective brands.

Excellent point Robert. "Dr. Death" Steve Williams mentioned that there was a lot more usage he saw as he was working his way up.

I agree that there is a lot of steroid use in wrestling, but I'm ok with it, I think HGH and steroids should not be illegal or banned, but thats an opinion. He didn't kill his family from roid rage, the people who think that are ludicrous, nothing on that level has happened before to people who have to have been bigger steroid users than benoit.

Everyone always gets preachy about steroids, but if there was a pill or a shot that you could take that would make you 50% more productive at whatever you do and thus earn 50% to 100% more money, with no chance of being caught because your employer knowingly doesn't test for substances, who wouldn't do it. This is all within reason of course.

People are going to do what they are going to do. We do not live in a more violent society as a lot of people like to point out, we live in a society with 24 hour news and 24 hour internet reporting. It's a tragedy what happened, and everyone is looking for the logic behind such brutality, but that is the irony in this. It was an entirely illogical act without reason.

I wouldn't. And that's a pretty steep assumption to make, Coop.

I might not get caught by my employer, but I would be caught by my self, in some form or fashion. HGH and steroids are not without their side effects, and putting that crap into my body puts me at risk for a painful and premature death.

Even if they didn't carry those physical risks, I still wouldn't, because as ambitious as I am, I would know that the level at which I was achieving wasn't because of my own hard work. If there were a pill that I could take that would make me a better photographer, I wouldn't touch it. First of all, I'm already pretty damn good . Secondly, I would want any improvement that I make as an artist to come through my own efforts, through studying my work and the work of others and looking to eliminate mistakes and tighten up the manner through which I express my vision. I may never be the best photographer in the world, and I may never be the richest, and I may never be known outside a very small circle of people, but I'll have done my work with integrity, and that's a more important legacy to leave, in my opinion.

I'm not sure on the advancements of steroids over the years...but the only reason I feel this was because of steroids is because I personally saw someone about 12 or 13 years ago actually have a roid rage on one of my good friends for no reason whatsoever. It was pretty scary.

That is all true, but steroids and HGH aren't miracle pills or shots, they can only be successful, when used in conjuction with pre-existing skill and continued levels of very hard work.

Some media members make it sound like I could take steroids and then go out and hit 40 homers a year or whatever the equivalent is in other sports. Those kind of drugs are no different to me than smoking for relaxation, or lasik surgery for increased visual acuity. Both have severe possible side effects, but are weighted by each persons decision about what is best for their body.

(ps. I'm aware my opinion on steroids is unpopular, but I think they can be very productive when used correctly and under proper supervision, the problem is meatheads who use 3 times what is needed.)

Let's keep in mind that steroids have long term effects and one being depression. I think this is where this tragedy may have stemmed from. I'm still in the opinion Chris had some type of mental illness and all these factors added up to it in the end: The steroid depression possible factor, the non-stop work schedule, the constant travel, plus lets not forget these wrestlers have to work our when not performing. This to me is not an issue of the WWE needing to get necessarily stricter on their policies, but this is the WWE needing to really look out for their employees.

They need to make this wrestlers take time off every year. Does this mean having a superstar always set to lose a belt if they've had it for at least a year, maybe. And I think that's fine. They need to take care of these people. Hell, don't we all need to take a week or two off of our jobs a year just to recharge sometimes? These guys do more than any of us do to the point of physical and mental exhaustion at times, regardless if you respect their jobs or not. They give their bodies and minds to their jobs. They need time to relax and unwind and enjoy time with their family. Instead a lot of them will unwind with alcohol, drugs, and random God knows what else after a show. The only time off these guys get ourwhen they are injured so that means their time off is doing physical therapy to get back in shape for more wrestling. It's ridiculous. And what happens is these guys get so burned out that some of them snap and thats when WWE tells them its time to go (example Kurt Angle's breakdown). I think the Roid Rage excuse for the Benoit deaths is a lazy way of the media hype machine reporting. However, Vince needs to get his shit together and take care of the people that have made him a multi-millionaire.